PATREON EXCLUSIVE: How Important Is It To Date Someone Of The Same Socio-Economic Background?

I don't think I could be in long term relationship with a woman who has not gone to college. Not only is education important to me, but it tells me something about my partner's life goals, and also there is that thing about having similar experiences.

Luge Fisker

I think this makes a lot of sense. I can't be with someone who didn't at least have many common interests, and similar life experiences, or at least very strongly skilled in empathy and openness and who lives a healthy lifestyle. I'd be intimidated to date someone above the middle class range. I like living simply. I'd go in a canoe rather than on a yacht. I'd rather go camping in a tent than an RV. I'd rather shop at a local boutique, than at Versace. Even if they were really down to Earth, I'd still feel guilty about it, like they would want to pay for everything all the time- I've been provided for in a middle class home for about 4 years now. And even asking for gas money puts me on edge.

I’m probably the individuated type to a degree. I started out as an art major for my bachelor degree and had long hippie hair in the 80s. I later (cut my hair and) got a PhD in Linguistics and went to Oklahoma and worked on an endangered Native American language for over 15 years and became rather culturally embedded. I dated a Native American woman, and was pretty well in tune with her on most levels. One thing that eventually did come up, though was religion. She was Christian and very spiritual as most Native Americans seem to be. Like most academics, I was an atheist. It wasn’t a problem at first, as she was willing to follow my lead. But there came a death in the family at one point and spirituality grew in importance and became a much larger divide than what it started out as.

Todd McDaniels

Can please share the link to the video you did on Cultural capital and relationship dynamics. I can't seem to find it.

I am the sort of individual you describe, and it really is as good as you imagine, except when it comes to finding a partner in life. As an individual, you come to discover yourself largely alone, which I suppose shouldn't really come as a surprise when you think about it. People get together in relationships to fulfill roles for each other. But if you aren't a "role player", it makes your presence somewhat nebulous. Why are you here? What do you do? Is "I just like having you around" really a good enough reason to be in a relationship? Individualism is inevitable for some people (like me) but it's also sort of a... deterrent for relationships. Would I encourage it? Yes, if you're able (and not everyone is). But I would also warn you that you may find yourself alone. In fact, that is the most likely outcome.

This actually makes so much sense to me. Maybe this explain why i find it very difficult to be in a relationship with women from where i live. I'm just too different from the people around me.

akira RK

Fascinating perspective as always, Alex. Thanks for the video 👍

Kevin

When you say “you pass,” what does that mean? That you pass as “white” so there wasn’t a super visual race/ethnic different between you and your husband? Or does it mean something else?

My husband is one year older than me. We are both from white, low-middle class families and grew up in areas that were kind of small town in some ways but also really pretty diverse population wise (he was Maryland and I grew up in the suburbs of Philadelphia, PA). We both had stay at home moms, dads who worked blue collar jobs, and were very close with our grandparents. We were both the first kids in our families to ever go to college (but had to get scholarships to do so. I had academic scholarships and my husband, although white, got a minority scholarship because he went to a college with predominantly black students). When we first started talking seriously he had moved to Colorado and I was in New York (I.e. we both had ambitions to get out of the towns where we grew up and make something of ourselves). I absolutely believe this played into how easily we connected - we had so many shared values, especially as it relates to our individualism, work ethic, views on money, political views, career/lifestyle goals, and views on what a healthy relationship/marriage looks like.

Alex, I would love to hear your perspective on social desirability bias and how that effects dating and attracting someone from a different ethnic background.

As soon as you recognize yourself as a highly autonomous person - you need a highly autonomous person too as a partner. and in my case, it brings a lot of unknown - as I really don't know what the future will bring - so all the stiff concepts how the future should look like for a couple - I'm ughh... listen - let see how we feel with that ;)

For the most part, I agree with Alexander, only based on my personal experience.  This video was very interesting to me because: -I'm an ethnic minority, but I pass. -I was a poor kid, but ended up marrying a white man from an upper middle class background. -My family had no expectations for me at all, so when he talks about being individuated, for me it's like, from what? My perspective of how class or other socio economic factors affect a relationship is based mostly on my experiences dating white men while passing.  While my husband and I achieved alot together, I think it would've been easier if I had been from a closer social class to him. If I didn't pass, I think socio-economic pressures would've been more prevalent in my mate selection.  But since they weren't, I only had my basic hypergamy to go by (not that I knew what that was at the time.) I knew I wanted someone who had similar values and life goals as me, but who also came from one or two class levels higher than myself.  (The classes were defined by me in my head, of course.  Someone on the outside might've seen us as being the same social class, or complete opposites, I don't know.) Anyway, I found a good one who happened to be white and married him. But we still had money problems.  His parents/ grandparents were responsible with money and sacrificed a lot, so I thought those values/ knowledge had been passed down. But the guy couldn't save a penny to save his life.  I provided most of the financial security for our family.  He got better and is now financially literate.  But assuming that a high class background meant financial security was my mistake. If I was also high class, I might've been raised to avoid that. We still had/have cultural problems.  Similar to what Alexander described with the foreign exchange student, my hubby, and a few other men I've dated or slept with, thought I was exotic and unique.  They thought they were progressive, cool and not-racist because they had a not-white gf/booty call. Until they realized that it wasn't performative or a hobby, and I expected my man to respect my culture and help me teach it to our future children. I think my hubs thought I was joking and I would suddenly assimilate when we got married and had a kid. We still had conforming/ expectation problems.  His family/society expected a alot from him and there was shame if you didn't deliver.  My family had none for me, but my community had conflicting expectations, so kids grew up with mixed messages and many said 'fuck it I have no idea who the hell I'm supposed to be so I'll guess I'll be a nobody.'  So my hubby and I both struggled, in our own way, to make our own way, and reconcile with our family histories. We wanted to do it together, but had competing interests for a while.  It took a long time to get on the same page and for our families to come to terms. One thing we didn't have were social and pop culture problems.  We made a number of friends together early in our relationship.  And we were both curious to learn new things at that time, so if we liked different movies or music or activities it was exciting for us, not a source of tension.  Even now, if one likes something the other doesn't, we either take turns compromising, or we just do it by ourselves.

Jennifer Coopman

Alex, are you referring to C.G. Jung's idea of individuation or is it something different?

Hardik Gupta

Retired now, but I was an educated, middle class professional all of my working life. During that time, I dated several wealthy women with whom we had lots in common. But,regardless of their financial comfort and security, all demanded that I earn more. They didn't need the money but psychologically needed it. You might think such an arrangement will work, but I'm willing to bet anything it won't. For me, the same applies politically. I know some attractive women from the other end of the spectrum, but I couldn't date them. I have strong political values, and, like religion, cannot be with a woman who's so different.

Roger Hayden