Call and Response: Bonfireside Chat: Marika and Midra
Added 2025-01-12 17:29:28 +0000 UTCHey tarnished! It's time to write in with your responses on any Finger Stuff or Abyssal Woods/Midra's Manse in Elden Ring. Submit your response as a comment on this post! As always, keep some guidelines in mind.
Keep your responses and stories specific to Finger Stuff, Abyssal Woods or Midra's Manse
Please keep your responses brief. Think two short paragraphs, or around 200 words.
Specificity is preferred over generalities.
We tend to get a lot of responses, so please don't feel bad if we omit your response, or edit it for length.
The deadline is the end of the day, Sun. January 19th.
Comments
Way too late past the deadline but really want to hear your guys' thoughts on The Frenzied Flame's nature in relation to Metyr and The Greater Will following the DLC's expansion on both concepts. Metyr is described as "the mother of all Two Fingers and Fingercreepers... a magnificently gleaming daughter of the Greater Will." I believe the specific naming of "all Two Fingers" is quite deliberate in its eschewing of The Three Fingers. Many have asked if Midra was touched by The Three Fingers, a seemingly required step in becoming Lord of Frenzied Flame. Now that we (presumably) know The Three Fingers did NOT come from Metyr, I would posit that the process to becoming The Lord of Frenzied Flame in the base game is merely an elaborate production to make YOU accept your role fully and utterly. There was no "Three Fingers," there was no need for Hyetta as a "maiden." The "Will" longing for a return to wholeness manifested itself in the ways it knew a Tarnished would trust and revere. Fingers, maidens, a divine quest, there are all things this Force invented as perversions of the Greater Will's culture in order to suggest familiarity in its own machinations. Midra was not Tarnished, so there was no need for this song and dance. Lastly, I find it so interesting that Frenzy's heralds and prophets describe The Flame as "chaos," when the thinking madman should really understand that it is a return to order in its simplest, basest form. Hyetta's dialogue on "The One Great" contextualizes Elden Ring's universe in a Gnostic lens. We are told all was once united, perhaps equally divine. Then The Greater Will, in the role of the Demiurge, fractured and shattered (LIKE MARIKA OMG) the primordial soup into the material plane.
Mansoor
2025-01-24 06:10:24 +0000 UTCThis is my favorite moment in this or any video game, and Marika became my favorite character in this or any video game when I got here. Brief story time: years ago, but for years, I lived on a beautiful, isolated island off the coast of Washington helping out my dad as he slowly died of cancer. After he passed, I was really traumatized and moved away. Last spring, I visited that island again. It felt both indescribably important and totally empty. I don’t think I’ll go back. Right after that, Erdtree came out. This moment with Marika felt like the perfect reflection of what I had experienced; both in her desire to honor this place and what had happened there, as well as her recognition that there was nothing left there now for her, and that she wouldn’t be coming back. I don’t know how much of this is head canon, but for me it made Marika the POV character in Elden Ring, and completely changed my experience of the rest of the game. (Probably too long/ off topic to be an actual response, but wanted to share)
Charley
2025-01-20 00:11:05 +0000 UTCAs someone who doesn’t care for the Abyssal Woods or Metyr as a boss fight, I will say that the lore particularly revolving around Metyr I adore. I always thought it was strange the Two Fingers were promoting different Empyreans to overthrow the existing order, and wondered if maybe they (or the finger readers) were manipulating events, claiming it was the Greater Will’s… will. The revelation that the GW abandoned Metyr means the Fingers were no more divine than any other being. When one promoted the Gloam Eyed Queen, were they told to by Metyr, or did they just do it to claim influence for themself? Did the Fingers compete for power? People seemed to think “might makes right” was the way of the GW, in part since the Fingers promoted Empyreans to overthrow the existing order. Now we know this wasn’t something the GW wanted or not - it’s indifferent to what happens, which is a cold but very real way for the universe to be set up.
Lucas West
2025-01-19 19:05:45 +0000 UTCSimilar to you all, I really did find myself loving the atmosphere of the Abyssal Woods and Midra’s Manse. I ended up getting lost a lot and finally stumbling into the Divided Falls. The split with 2 falls on one side and the 3 falls on the other is likely just a reference to Hyetta’s statements about the origin of the Three Fingers and the Frenzied Flame from the One Great. However, I can’t help but imagine that these falls function as the origin for that myth within the religion. That like the river splitting into odd and even sides, the one great did as well. I could easily see Shabiri, Nanaya, or whoever else was spitting Frenzied Flame lore at people using this landmark to make their argument for the bringing about the Lord of Frenzied Flame.
Michael Crawford
2025-01-17 14:46:45 +0000 UTCIn my first run through Abyssal Woods, I misinterpreted one of the dev messages as saying the things prowling around were invisible (similar to Aava in DSII). Given the scale of the area, I was expecting to be ambushed by some giant unseen chaos monster at any moment until I found an item that would allow me to see it. Ultimately this made the reveal of the Aging Untouchables a little disappointing, but the tense experience I had beforehand is one of my favorites in the series.
Beef Stu
2025-01-16 22:28:50 +0000 UTCI really loved the journey to Midra. Having the frenzy-eyed wildlife wait until you were close before even bothering to run away made it look less like a response of fear and more like one of disdain; I never imagined they would find such a use for what most players saw as either set dressing or crafting material dispensers. My biggest letdown with regards to the Aging Untouchables was that the notes set my imagination ablaze too much and made me hope for some kind of near-silent frenzy dragon patrolling the skies. As for Midra himself, I think he might be my favorite boss in all of Elden Ring. It's really strange to say they tried something new with the music, and that new thing is the bwaaaaah that everything did after Inception came out, but it worked so well alongside the callback to the frenzied merchants' song. After finishing the DLC, it's this entryway I returned to over and over to help others out. Funny how the madness boss was the boss that made me the least mad.
Sid Menon
2025-01-14 01:32:18 +0000 UTCMy favorite thing about Shadow of the Erdtree was using the landmarks and imperfect map to try to sleuth out a way to the next region. After finding the Sealing Tree (which was clearly leading to the end of the DLC), I needed to find out what was down in that last chunk northwest of Jagged Peak. No way past the wall in the Finger Ruins, no way down from Bonny Village, or Ellac River. I finally gave up and Wiki-ed it, realizing I missed a ladder in Shadow Keep 30 hours ago. But the reveal of the Abyssal Woods after the fight with Jori was worth all the frustration. One of my all-time FromSoft moments.
Jared Mogen
2025-01-13 18:13:54 +0000 UTCRegarding Commander Gaius, I agree that his fight is brutal and his lore is a little lame with him being another FromSoft "Oh they were actually here the whole time" DLC introduction, but a teeny tiny detail from him has the potential to add a lot to the lore in my opinion. Gaius is explicitly confirmed to be an Albinauric in an item description which is weird, because if you bleed him during his fight, he bleeds red instead of the usual Albinauric pale blood. Could be an oversight or maybe we're seeing the boar's blood, but I think this is circling back to the question around if Loretta is an Albinauric. One of the big pieces of evidence used to shut down the theory of Loretta being an Albinauric is the fact that she bleeds red in her fight, but now we have a 100% confirmed Albinauric character that also bleeds red. This might be a bit more of a stretch, but my personal theory is that there was a middle generation of Albinaurics that was a sort of limited run or were purposefully wiped out and led the Albinauric's creators to downgrade the next generation to near-mindless frog people. This could also explain Phillia, the "young yet towering" sister at the end of Latenna's quest, who looks around Gaius/Loretta-sized give or take. I like the idea of these middle generation Albinaurics being made more human-like as an improvement to the original formula, but having the unexpected ability to reproduce (see Latenna's mention of the "Birthing Droplet"). This horrified their creators in a Mary Shelly's Frankenstein kinda way, who wiped them out with the exception of Gaius and Loretta, who were both protected by their status as knights, and Phillia, who was kept hidden away in the Consecrated Snowfield. After that, seeing how they flew too close to the sun, the Creators made the following generation of Albinaurics into vacant, genderless fucked up lil guys that do cartwheels. I know there isn't a lot of text to support this, and I might be reaching for a few things, nevertheless, hope yall enjoy my wacky ramblings. Love the show!
B Alaska
2025-01-13 04:26:54 +0000 UTCI had a truly unique experience entering the Abyssal Woods for the first time. When I sat down to play that day after work I noticed my internet was down. Tried some fixes, but to no avail. Whatever, it's Elden Ring, losing the multiplayer features of that game aren't a big deal. I had stopped my previous play session right at the entrance of the woods. When I entered the developer note stuck out, like a message to me personally. The usual helpful player hints and silly jokes were all gone. It was a real spooky experience wandering around this largely empty area without the glowing messages to help point you in the right direction. It felt so isolating. As if the Frenzied Flame had come and haunted my internet to make me brave the Abyss alone. Couldn't have happened at a better time.
Matt DiTomaso
2025-01-13 00:44:46 +0000 UTCEDIT: I don't know if I missed a Call and Response?? This isn't one of the areas you mentioned, but I don't recall a roundtable episode for the Church District. Obviously no worries if it doesn't fit :) ______ The funniest moment of the DLC for me occurred in the Church District. I'm generally a huge scaredy-cat playing these games... Tip-toeing everywhere, shield glued to my face, etc. When I came across the flooded district and heard the monster swimming around, knocking over trees, I thought, "Oh great, what unspeakable horror awaits me down there?" I dreaded the inevitable ass-whooping. After draining the water and making my way down, I crept through the grounds, heart pounding, steeling myself for whatever nightmare was ahead. As I inched past some crabs digging around in the dirt... BAM! A giant crab burst out of the ground! I jumped, bolted for the nearest building, then howled with laughter. The thought of this crab zooming through the water at top speed... Absolute gold. "You got me, FromSoft. Good one! After all that build up, can't believe THAT was the monster." Of course, it wasn't.
Al
2025-01-13 00:37:51 +0000 UTCThe Abyssal Woods and Midra’s Manse are so full of rancid vibes and unsettling details that make for a extremely creepy experience. I love the cinder necked execution line in front of the manor in particular. Something that undermined my expectations and added to the creep factor was the Spirit NPC that you encounter near the entrance. I found it off-putting that it addresses you directly. Every other spirit seems to be a snapshot of a person either speaking out loud to themselves, or to another person that was in front of them at the time. This speaker knew how to intentionally leave this spirit message. I don’t think there’s much to dig in to here, like the burnt library perhaps including some lost knowledge of spirt messages, but I found the detail evocative. (Two minutes of googling later) there is another example of a spirit NPC directly addressing you. The very first one that directs you to the tutorial cave. 🤷🏻
Steven Meadows
2025-01-13 00:01:53 +0000 UTCOn a lore level the finger stuff is the definite highlight of the DLC for me. In the base game I really loved the weird physicality of the Outer Gods (e.g. the Formless Mother having blood you can throw around, the Fire Giants' god manifesting on their bellies), and the eventual reveal of Metyr's creepy twisted form had me in heaven. It's also really cool how it subverted an already-cool subversion from the base game. When you burn the Erdtree, Enia implies that communications with the Greater Will are bounded by the speed of light (or some mystical analogue of that), and I was really into that hard-sci-fi touch in an otherwise very obviously fantasy game. But then the DLC reveals that in fact the Two Fingers weren't communicating with the Greater Will at all, they were just hearing Metyr's rambling! So that raises the (unimportant) question in my mind: would that take thousands of years because Metyr's stuck in the shadowlands, making communication more difficult? Or because Metyr needed that much time to make up something new? The only downside to the finger stuff for me is how clearly the Fingercreepers were just pasted in there after the fact ("the mother of all Two Fingers and Fingercreepers"). From their placement as enemies etc they aren't in any way I can tell connected to the Two Fingers, the Greater Will, or anything like that. This probably just comes down to them being reused assets from something Rykard-related, and FromSoft deciding during DLC development that they needed some sort of explanation. It obviously doesn't ruin my enjoyment of the finger stuff as a whole, but it's still a bit of a bummer to be so reminded of the ways that lore sometimes arises just as a way to weld already-developed assets together.
Kenny
2025-01-12 22:17:35 +0000 UTCMidra, the motherfucking Lord of Frenzied Flame. Put some respect on his forsaken God given name. His sword being his spine, and his spine being the device used to torture him is metal as fuck. As far as I know he uses all of the frenzy spells that can you can use. And his head being replace by the Sauron-eye, perfection. My only gripe was that it wasn't clearly explained to me why the said "fuck midra, let's make his life hell." Other than that, Perfection. I want to propose a theory for the Finger Creepers. I'm not sure how to explain how, why, or where they come from (other than... yknow). But it's more so their role in the world. I think they are vermin/pests of some sort. If you think about it, they only appear in areas that are abandoned or neglected. What made me come to this conclusion is the Swarm of them that appears in the Northern Finger, Ruins. I sat there for a good 5 minutes just watching them. The way the larger Creepers guide the smaller ones, like they are protecting them, makes me think they have animalistic nature to them. I don't know. Just wanted to share my thoughts and hear what you guys think.
Brady Nodolf
2025-01-12 18:45:52 +0000 UTCThe Abyssal Woods sure is a dramatic area, even if suffers at the hands of this DLC having one too many big open areas where not a lot happens. Even though it acts as an extended corridor guiding the player towards Midra's Manse, I still got incredibly lost here, constantly hitting dead ends with messages saying "Rain!", "Hurray For Rain!" etc. On a return visit, I realised that I'd been foolishly going round in circles and that the route to the Manse was remarkably close to the Site of Grace. While I loved The Manse, and wish it could have actually been a little longer, The Abyssal Woods loses points for me because as well as being a bit sparse, it's one of the few times FromSoft tell rather than show. Developer soapstones telling me how scary an area is feels a bit on-the-nose to me. Elden Ring has plenty of scary places, especially compared to this quite pretty autumnal area. And no, I haven't forgotten about the lanterns - they are very terrifying, I admit.
Charlie Frame
2025-01-12 18:06:05 +0000 UTC
