MM34 - Fame & Psychosis: The Red Shoes & Perfect Blue

Phenomenal episode I gotta watch the red shoes now. I watched this because I wanted to hear your take on perfect blue and I left wanting to watch the red shoes

Zach

Also, in Perfect Blue, does anyone else feel a slight connection to the real tragic, events of Selena? Maybe a stretch but felt similar in some ways.

Lee

Kon is one of my top 5 directors period. Hes so so so good. Incredibly missed. Paranoia Agent, Paprika, Millenium Actress, and an amazing Christmas movie, Tokyo Godfathers (great chaser after PB ha) Also still so sad that Kon’s last movie, ‘Dreaming Machine’ hasn’t been produced. Don’t know that it ever will. But so grateful for what we do have of his genius.

Lee

Check out Paranoia Agent and Millenium Actress too- and Tokyo Godfathers is a truly uplifting Kon movie that I watch every Christmas! :)

Lee

Satashi Kon dying youngish is such a huge what if in cinema

Gabriel

I watched the red shoes last night and god damn what a picture. We love movie mindset

Blown Load Steve Austin

Hey, since you'd probably know, is Mima's name a reference to the verb "to watch"? ( 見ます)

Richard R

And, if my recall is correct, Mima also lapses into her Kansai accent when she’s alone in her room. Most notably when she breaks down about not wanting to do the rape scene— a moment of honesty and authenticity that she rarely affords herself or is afforded by anyone else in her life. By putting on a fake accent, she’s effectively “acting” in every scene of the movie save for when she’s alone in her room.

Gabe Juniper

Great episode. A detail on Perfect Blue that gets lost in translation: when Mima’s on the phone with her mom, it reveals that she and her mom speak in a Kansai accent. The rest of the movie Mima speaks in a Tokyo accent because it’s the “standard” accent that people who work in Japanese entertainment are expected to emulate regardless of what part of the country they’re from. It adds another layer to the artifice of Mima’s public persona— she can’t even speak the way she naturally would if it weren’t for the expectations placed on her by her industry.

Gabe Juniper

This is an exclusively Tim-head, anti-hobbit podcast. Greg-heads aren't welcome.

Eamon Short

Banger ep 🔥

Ryan Eiffert

Watched Red Rooms after it was mentioned on this episode and it really deserves its own movie mindset review. Insane stuff

Sasha Kosek

1:32:30 I’m not sure if it’s cuz I wanted the dub but the rape scene does get its own name after they pause the scene

professional loaf of bread

jesus what a ride!

oo __

hey bro, take your exalted elocution and make your own podcast.

oo __

Also would be worth going more in-depth when talking about Aronofsky ripping off Perfect Blue so blatantly is so annoying - Perfect Blue becomes more and more pertinent and horrifying every day in how accurate its predictions are regarding modern culture and the internet, to the point where the film now speaks to not only celebrity culture, but the culture of social media at large, whether you're a celebrity or not. Aronofsky kinda took all the visual motifs and mind-trickery from it and made it about... ehh? The chase for perfection? And as a result the movie feels far, far less empathetic to women than Perfect Blue was.

Sean Peden

A couple notes for Perfect Blue: The final line is recited by Rumi's voice actress, not Mima's. Also Satoshi Kon repeatedly said he was almost embarrassed by how darksided Perfect Blue is compared to the rest of his filmography. The funny part to me is he said he, in no way, meant for it to be a particular critique of the idol industry and that he wanted to be respectful about it. Imma be real dog, I don't believe him lol. The other thing of note is that he had stated that the original intent was to depict a story about an identity crisis with a happy ending, that it's intended to be a story of a woman finding herself. Again, I gotta say, I have a tough time believing him. Not that he came across as a dishonest person by any means at all, I think he was very much informed by Japan's culture of politeness and not ruffling feathers, like he would be too sheepish or uncomfortable to call it out directly. Either that, or he didn't create the movie he intended to create - hence his distancing from it in his later years. I think I see Satoshi Kon as someone who was genuinely tapped into humanity in a very, VERY real way - so tapped in that the "respectful" depiction of the idol industry can't exist: his commitment to reality and the human condition just expose the horrifying nature of celebrity culture whether he wanted to or not. If he was gonna show something real, he's gonna show something fucked up - idol/celebrity culture and the entertainment industry simply *are* that fucked up.

Sean Peden

I worked on a little homage to Perfect Blue at work a few years ago

grant brown

Yarblockos

I like this show but the intro music fills me with dread

Tess

Episode on Colonel Blimp when

J Fitz

The Red Shoes blew my mind

sweetiepie

Love a good Hesse-programmed ep

Drew

Genuinely curious if Will and Hessa have seen Kaurismäki’s Proletariat trio

Katrina Harms

Movie Mindset is my fave

Katrina Harms

Ooooooooh. Wow. The camera. I can't believe I never caught that. The lyrics on that album are totally in synch with this too.

Last Years Man

Yes. Hesse is truly an equal partner in this and it seems like she sometimes struggles to get a word in. Her insights are always really interesting and coming from a different angle than (though perfectly complementary to) the usual Dry Boy analysis.

Last Years Man

The commentary on Perfect Blue is spot on. As someone lives in Japan and subtitles Japanese media for a living, I can add a couple more layers. Not only is identity in flux or even non-existent throughout the film, but in Japan, a good portion of a person's identity is defined from without, rather than within. You are defined by your social relationships and your obligations to others. So beyond the commodification (which is definitely true) of body and soul in the entertainment industry, there's also a tendency to rationalize and even romanticize the relationship between artist and fan. The artist is taught that they owe their very existence to fans and that the fans must come first. The fan also makes their membership in the larger fan group a key part of their identity too. It's reciprocal and truly parasocial, rather than just transactional. For either of them to prioritize themselves is seen as a betrayal and it's not uncommon for celebrities here to apologize to their fans and their sponsors for various transgressions - even something as simple as having a romantic partner (which is forbidden for most pop idols). This isn't necessarily because of the sexual aspect but more that the artist has an obligation to maintain the fans' dream of attainability. So Mima is really assaulted from all sides and there are many "hands in the pie" of her identity, both meta and personal.

Last Years Man

I don’t think the ending of Perfect Blue was nonsensical, if anything I think it was a brilliant reveal of the MKULTRA sx slave sorta situation she was in…

Sam Z

I loved Paprika back in the day but never looked any further into Kon's work until getting ready for this episode; Perfect Blue fucks with your perception and certainty so much harder than Paprika. Wow and thanks to Will and Hesse for putting listeners up on this absolute heater 💐🙏🔥

Matthew

BANGER. BANGER. BANGER.

triplehashbrown

I watched the Perfect Blue for this show cause it looked like a kinda sweet anime but goddamn that movie is *fucked up*

Creemi

Thank you I love you both

Eran Greenberg

Real shit, you should do the color purple… That said, I’ve no interest in the Red Shoes, but I did convince my wife to watch Perfect Blue a few years ago. Big mistake.

Eater

On the topic of colour movies, I first saw Perfect Blue in a triple bill with Three Colours Blue and Blue Velvet, all first times.

Nah

Shout out to another Perverts Guide link.

Hot Rod

Came here for this - and for Zizek’s Perverts Guide to Cinema

Hot Rod

I also heard "wall" not "war"

awwwwwwww

I want to know more about Hesse's Sex In The City lifestyle watching movies with Ballerinas and wig experts.

Dustin Johnson

A Canterbury Tale!

Rohmer Simpson

Will, commendable improvement on controlling your enthusiasm. You guys are even better when Hesse has a little more breathing room. Thanks for making these. Real nice to hear people talk about art and what they love in between the dark realities of American politics.

ERIC

Hey guys

Fuckfaceitis

if The Red Shoes got its hooks into you but you're keen to see how much these lads (P&P) can flex, make these a priority: The Small Back Room, I Know Where I'm Going!, Gone to Earth (but not the Selznick hatchet job), 49th Parallel, One of Our Aircraft is Missing, as well as the aforementioned The Life and Death of Colonel Blimp, Black Narcissus, A Matter of Life and Death....... Oh hang it all if you can get hold of any of their films, or Powell's solo efforts, do so. Thank me later

Rohmer Simpson

GKIDS are confirmed MM fans https://x.com/GKIDSfilms/status/1917594279372878244

Chapo Trap House

If Will liked The Red Shoes, then a future season needs to cover Powell & Pessburger’s work with Black Narcissus and The Life and Death of Colonel Blimp.

Zach H.

I like it when Hesse programs an absolute fever dream of an episode

Tim O'

Music Mindset

PEE Vacation

Never seen The Red Shoes but the Kate Bush album inspired by it is fantastic.

PEE Vacation

So funny when people complain about these, you know you can just not listen! Love MM and Hesse <3

Luisa

7bb. M.klmg.lkwwm

Ripley Smokes

https://youtu.be/pS8oaMFsBEk?feature=shared

T

The first time I will actually watch a movie before listening to this. I’ve seen Perfect Blue, it’s one of my favorites, but I’ve never seen The Red Shoes. Very interested in the comparison between these two.

Axel Herrera

I gotta watch all the Powell & Pressburger films, I get stuck on Black Narcissus & The Red Shoes bc they are so beautiful & I enjoy the psychosexual, but I've heard great things about I Know Where I'm Going.

Letty

The Red Shoes is such a beautiful nightmare. Perfect Blue is upsetting and genius. What a great combo, love some women having a nervous breakdown cinema. I need to know if Hesse has read House of Psychotic Women by Kier-La Janisse.

Letty

It's hilarious that the trailer for perfect blue starts out with the GKIDS label.

Dick Van Sexel

Not only do massive bottles of wine and champagne exist, their names go CRAZY as size increases. They get like Evangelion names https://productswizard.com/images/wine-bottle-size-chart.jpg

Rohmer Simpson

Never saw em. Look too scary 😨

justDave

“A real Freddy Lounds situation“ huh Menaker… Always teasing this pilgrim with the Hunter and never delivering the Mann.. -Great episode, I love nothing more than when y’all toss out in episode film Recs: I have red rooms cued up to watch with my partner tonight, after we play secret intruder by god!

Anthony koz

It’s an extremely Chapo movie

bruce

God, I love perfect blue. Please consider next time possibly doing a double feature of something with paprika, another amazing kon joint, but this time concerned with how being online is melting down all of accepted sociality into an amorphous slop that drives us insane

bruce

Love the Archers! Esp A Canterbury Tale and I Know Where I’m Going. Powell and Pressburger’s movies have such a strong sense of humanity and understanding of eccentricity. And Anton Walbrook’s performances in this and Colonel Blimp are so nuanced and compelling.

emalco

Perfect Blue is like, a perfect movie, RIP Satoshi Kon, I really think he had a knack for portraying the permeability of reality, loved Paprika and Paranoia Agent for this reason as well, but Perfect Blue really captures the disorienting factor

Anomalie

Perfect Blue comes in around 1:07:30- ish; nothing against Red Shoes I just wanted to see it first before hearing the episode

Dustin Nelson

Obviously Kieslowski’s The Three Colours trilogy would be pure movie mindset

John Harwood

Smile 2 is a 90% ripoff of perfect blue

nick

Next seasons color episode could really just be both of saulnier’s “colors”, both of those movies are perfect

The Out

I really loved how the first time we see Mima the focus is on her wearing the Red Shoes and then the screen pans upwards to reveal her identity.

TC

He spent 30 years in asylums, not speaking, drawing sketchbook after sketchbook of the eyes he felt looking at him, thousands of invisible eyes, which was among the more reasonable reactions to World War I, and I think EQUUS might be loosely based on him too, because he had some kind of fixation with being a big-dicked horse

Michael S. Judge

Diaghilev and the Ballet Russes were the people who put on Stravinsky's early productions too, including the famous RITE OF SPRING premiere that turned into a riot, and not so much about the music, but because Diaghilev let his best male dancer Vaslav Nijinsky choreograph the thing, and it's really worth looking up a filmed production with the original dancing, because Nijinsky went stupid doodoo dumb (and then went insane)

Michael S. Judge

I don't why it took me years to realize this, but just the other day, I suddenly clocked that the cover of THIS YEAR'S MODEL by Elvis Costello is supposed to be him in Powell's PEEPING TOM

Michael S. Judge

Perfect Blue is 🔥

Sam Ray

DO SHREK

Smooth Shrek

I watched PB when they showed it on “The Last Drive-In” and enjoyed it but the next day a close friend who watched it with us passed away and it’s unfortunately been tied to that since. Hoping this will help rehab it a bit, though I admit that is some selfish over-sharing!

Jason Chapa

Has anyone seen "The Story of Film: An Odyssey"? It's a wonderful docuseries on film history. One of the episodes features The Red Shoes

Michael Naatjes

Not a fan of the MM?

This is how Janis Joplin feels

Matty yglesias

Love you guys but don’t really appreciate how you post only when no one is awake

LEAH NELSON